The Private Man

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More On Masculine Social Confidence

Red Pill dating and attraction wisdom firmly states that women are attracted to confident men. A reader has sent me an email where he asks the following:

But what does it really mean? Confident in WHAT exactly? I get the archetype of the smooth sophisticated James Bond type but what about regular guys? To me a lot of what is considered confidence just comes off like a lot of what I call “false bravado” I like to use the Jersey Shore type guys as an example. Super confident with absolutely nothing to back it up just a lot of huffing and puffing with no substance. I dunno if it’s just the younger generation but I can’t relate to it.

These are excellent questions and simply must be answered if men are expected to be socially confident.

It’s important to note that social confidence is very different concept than ordinary confidence. A confident motorcyclist might take on a new road without hesitation. A confident metal worker might do the same with a complex fabrication. A confident actor might take on a new role knowing he can do the character justice. However, all three of these men may be unable to successfully deal with even ordinary social interactions. This is where social confidence comes in.

Masculine social confidence is a man’s ability and willingness to accept and influence social interactions with his benefit in mind and at his choosing. With this in mind, the reader is excoriating the Jersey Shore guys incorrectly. Those guys have social confidence. Is it backed up with real skills? Who cares? They do have real skills, real social skills.

In Pick-Up Artistry (PUA), there is the concept of “Frame”. Amongst other things, frame is a mental attitude where the man is in control of a particular social interaction. Charisma is part of that frame and social confidence is a huge part of Charisma. Social skills are absolutely vital in this area and social skills can be learned (link below).

Developing social confidence requires:

1. Social interaction awareness. Knowing the context of a social interaction is vital. This requires relatively passive observation without jumping into conversations. When dealing with women, this requires very the very feminine skills of social intuition and the ability to instantly read moods.
Gentlemen, this requires practice and time. A man coming off of a long marriage to re-enter the dating scene likely has lost these abilities. For an example, would a socially aware guy make an offensive joke at a funeral? Exactly.

2. Effective communication skills. This is basically knowing what to say and when to say it. This is where a man’s frame can quickly fall apart by being too reactive. A man doesn’t need to be chatty or garrulous. He simply needs to communicate when the time comes. That communication doesn’t even have to be verbal. Physical gestures (the smirk, the raised eyebrows, etc.) can communicate incredibly effectively.

3. Outcome independence. This is both PUA and common sense and yet it’s rather counter-intuitive when looking at the definition (above) of masculine social confidence. A man is supposed to lead the social interaction but outcome independence means that he’s also apathetic about the outcome. This speaks mostly to frame. If a man doesn’t care about what ultimately happens, he can have more influence on the social interaction precisely because he’s apathetic to the ultimate outcome… phone number? kiss close? seduction? He simply doesn’t care.

This is all subtle stuff and requires huge amounts of emotional intelligence (link below). That requires practice and that requires getting out of the house and dealing with people.

Succeed Socially

Emotional Intelligence

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20 thoughts on “More On Masculine Social Confidence

  1. mackPUA on said:

    Outcome independence is abundance mentality

    Its quite easy, just avoid giving a fuck, & be a aloof arrogant asshoe

    Lead & dominate & control the conversation at all times

    I know you make a living off stating the obvious, at least try & add to the narrative … jeez

    If she tries to change the subject, cut her off & continue

    The more resistance you overcome, the more crap your deliberately an asshole about the easier the lay

    Outcome independence in a nutshell…

    • Richard Cranium on said:

      Interestingly I got some “advice” recently to do just the opposite.

      I was told I was too “loud” and “dominated conversations.” I should not talk so much and just listen to females.

      I just went umm ok and shrugged it off. I’d rather have someone shit in my hat than sit in an Applebee’s listening to some daffy broad ramble on about her puppies and her job and just sit there like a fool.

    • DC Phil on said:

      Depends on what kind of woman you’re dealing with, and what her personality is like.

      The typical Americhick of a certain age responds well to “asshole game,” while the standard Eurochick doesn’t.

  2. Another way to approach gaining outcome independence is seeing each interaction as something for you to enjoy personally. I rarely care if other people enjoy the same conversations and activities I do – rather if they get bored or offended I expect them to filter themselves out. I also will do the same myself.

    This helps ensure that you stay around people whom you enjoy and whom enjoy you as well. You can’t do this with work bosses, but you can do it with anyone not related to your career. Don’t be afraid to leave a boring group or to command a conversation.

    I now hate social functions where I’m forced to sit with the same people all night if I don’t know them and can’t choose them. I’d much rather be able to float around as I want, and then take someone I’m enjoying to a quieter spot to engage in an in depth, more personal conversation.

    Just go have fun. Let social interactions lead you from one thing to the next.

    • DC Phil on said:

      This is social-selection and sorting, in other words. Like attracts like.

      Trouble is, it’s hard to get Red Pill around other Red Pill.

      • It’s social selection and sorting on my terms, which any healthy human being should be doing. If you’re not doing that you’re constantly allowing people access to your commitment without any qualifications on if they’ll be appreciative, add value to your life, or use your time/money/energy well on themselves when you could use it on yourself or a worthy person instead of them. This applies to both men and women, whether friends or romantic possibilities.

        You don’t need to limit it to ‘red pill’ and I would honestly advise against it.

        I personally require that the people in my life be people of strength and integrity with a positive energy. Broad definitions, but important. Strength of mind and body that allows them to act upon their environments and the world towards achieving their goals. Integrity so that I can trust that, whatever their moral code, I can expect them to stay reasonably close to it with room for them being human as they react to the world around them while they move forward. Positivity because neither I nor the world cares about your excuses, but I have dreams and goals, and I want to be within groups which can inspire each other to greater heights as we move through the world with strength and integrity.

        How they fit those definitions are fairly open, but they’re a requirement if people want to be around me. From there I get more specific based on a mutual relationship that we build together, be it co-worker, friend, short term lover, long term, or potential wife. The higher you get, the more in touch with the truth and reality (aka red pill) you have to be, and the more in agreement with my views you have to be. But I won’t deny auditions or entry into the ground floor of my life just because you’re not part of a group of minority elites from an unheard of corner of the internet.

  3. Anaïs on said:

    How about women PM? Do confident women stand a chance?

    • Woman are rarely confident, instead they are normally bitchy with an over inflated sense of self, but for the rare woman who is confident without the bullshit, doesn’t matter much. Her looks and feminine demeanor count for much, much more

      • DC Phil on said:

        Don’t forget the greater sense of herd mentality/groupthink, and in-group preference where women will rush to the other’s aid because they’re the same sex. Something comparable doesn’t exist in men, unfortunately.

  4. Pingback: More On Masculine Social Confidence | Viva La Manosphere!

  5. What should also be stressed along with the what and when is how to talk. Try to show some enthusiasm. Being aloof and outcome independent doesn’t mean you don’t show any emotions. From my experience women seem to like more of the emotion of the conversation than the actual words. I’ll talk about my day which is mostly ordinary things…but I bring an extraordinary attitude to it.

    Also I love new words…had to look up garolous.

    • The Lucky Lothario on said:

      Went out for coffee yesterday and spoke for about 45 minutes about quantum physics, the girl I was talking to loved it since its something I’m genuinely interested in and was enthusiastic about and can explain well to the layman. Possibly a boring topic but something I can talk about with passion, also in a frame of educating about the world she lives in. C.f, Krausers ideas on intellectual mastery.

    • DC Phil on said:

      Yep, interesting point. I’ve had those experiences in the past with female friends and a handful of women I’ve gone out with. Nowhere was this more evident than with the women who looked at me, enraptured, as I was going on, passionately, about some topic. They probably could have cared less about what I was saying, but were certainly caught up in the emotion of it all.

  6. I am confident in all I do because I have a life time of taking risks, failures and success. I tend to think this be confident deal is an attempt to short cut years of hard living and risk taking.

    Men who do not know what they can accomplish, who don’t yet understand their power, would be better served living dangerously for awhile.

  7. Pingback: More On Masculine Social Confidence May 30th |

  8. A great mistake is to conflate social confidence with masculine accomplishment. Men size up other men by their accomplishments and experience, which is natural considering it is through those things that a man is made. Those Jersey Shore guys have no accomplishments or experience worthy of masculine approval, hence most real men would rank them quite low among men. However, socially they are fairly adept and confident in their ability to get what they need from any given social situation. This is all the social proof a woman needs because the masculine hierarchy is (mostly) unfamiliar to her. The two are somewhat separate spheres of thought & knowledge.

    What you want to do is learn lots of social awareness while occasionally leaning on your accomplishments as a man (for support or internal confidence). This means that you need to take accurate stock of yourself as a man, what you’ve done, what you’ve experienced, and what your goals are. Be brutal about it. It is the absence of experience that you want to be aware of in a social setting because your conversation/social tactics will need to shift if a conversation goes in a direction in which you have nothing to offer. If people are talking about something you already know lots of about there’s never an issue because you can confidently participate in the discussion and observe reactions to what you’re saying or doing. So take accurate stock of your experiences, and avoid jumping into social situations where you have nothing to offer.

    What you eventually want to be is a guy who’s had great experiences, and/or accomplished cool shit while having a significant awareness of the social mood of the people around you. The best way to get there is to just get there. As an extreme example, Neil Armstrong probably never had to try any game on any woman in any social situation because he went to the f-ing moon. His experience was unequaled in most of humanity, so any woman would listen to what he had to say, and nearly all men would likewise shut up and listen. His social dominance was without question. Since we can’t all be the first man on the moon, find yourself some noteworthy experience or knowledge on which you can lean to gain the social awareness we all need. The confidence you seek comes from repeated successful contributions to social situations, nothing else will do.

    Strangely, late night call-in or self-help radio is actually a good source of learning social awareness as well. The best is Loveline which started in Los Angeles (KROQ). Listening closely to that show and how they deal with the people who call in is an invaluable resource in teaching you a lot about how people act based on what they’ve experienced thus far in their life. This learning is almost immediately applicable to social situations. Some people eventually become so attuned just from listening to loveline that they can actually spot specific forms of past abuse just by the behavior of the people they know.

    • Richard Cranium on said:

      Jeremy the point about the Jersey Shore crowd is a good one. Weather they’re doing something “right” or not isn’t my beef with them either I’m too old or the wrong demographic but I simply can’t relate to the mentality of the jock/frat-boy/douchebag with the out of whack sense of entitlement.

      I guess the main disconnect I’m having is the concept that being adept socially is the key to having chicks fall at your feet. Being a touring musician I’m in a different town every week and spend most of my time in bars and clubs. I’m always meeting new people and part of my job is being social to the crowd and the staff. We have a rule that no one will say that we had attitudes or weren’t easy to get along with and it helps out in the long run. People request us to come back and we get perks like a bar tab some how disappearing!

      I have no problem being funny, outgoing, personable. It makes me a lot of friends and acquaintances and keeps my band working but it doesn’t translate into pussy.

      • DC Phil on said:

        First, check out this guy:

        http://badgerhut.wordpress.com/

        Second, listen to this.

        I know Badger — casually — and went out with him on one occasion early last year to Baltimore. Bmore is more working class than DC is and, by extension, less pretentious, careerist, and, with the women there, hypergamous than DC-ites. Badger and I went to find out if the night life in Bmore was any different than the typical nightlife among the 20-something set here in DC.

        He and I visited three pubs and, while talking about Game and other topics, made the following observations:

        1. Bmore isn’t that much different than DC. The city has its fair share of douchebags and uppity, anti-social and socially retarded women, but in a different way. At least there are no Capitol Hill staffers floating around like there are in some parts of DC.

        2. In any given drinking establishment, it’s the same dynamic: groups of girls mugging for their iTurds so that they can post their pics on FB, guys keeping their distance, and beta orbiters. But, again, less so than in DC.

        Badger came to this conclusion: in order to make any kind of dent in the typical female attention span, you have to run “caveman game,” which amounts to being an in-your-face asshole. This is enough to get the typical girl to look up from her iTurd and acknowledge your existence.

        The Jersey Shore guys run caveman game regularly. This, apparently, is the new social norm in the US. Simply being a “nice” and pleasant guy isn’t enough anymore, though it might have been 20 years ago. Roosh documented this quite well in some of his blog posts from a few years ago, before his Euro sojourn.

        The thing I’ve always found funny is that these are the same girls who complain about douchebags, but will fall at their feet if they had the chance.

  9. Pingback: Busy Social Life, Busy Intellectual Life | The Private Man

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