How Will They Find Husbands?
I am not good at statistics. However, I am good a sensing socio-gender trends. Houston, we have a problem. It’s going to be a huge problem in about five years, especially so for the SWPL (Stuff White People Like) class.
There is going to be a huge husband shortage. Nevermind all the beta provider talk, this is a matter of statistics. Men aren’t going to college nearly as much as women, at least for the non-STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering, Math). So what we have is a gender imbalance in the collegiate humanities subjects. Let’s allow the admissions departments deal with that one. Oh, to be a fly on the wall in those meetings. Political correctness meets the stark reality of demographics in an epic cage fight. But no, the serious problem is post graduation.
Hello hypergamy. Women marry up. That’s biology, don’t fight it. With a plethora of young women armed with fresh (and likely useless) Bachelors of Arts degrees and a dearth of young men with equivalent degrees, the husband shortage becomes acute. Would a young woman marry down in the realm of education? Uh, no. Hell, there won’t even be enough STEM guys to bolster to rolls of the beta provider class of men.
The MRAs of the Manosphere talk mightily of the marriage strike. Dalrock has proven that there is not an actual strike, per se. He’s better with statistics than I am and so I respect his analysis of the subject.
The marriage strike will be nothing more than college-educated women who can’t find men of equal or higher value who are willing to commit to them. Sure, the alpha/charisma guys will happily bed them but as such guys will be in short supply, they have options and average Jane Cupcake with a BA in marketing will only be just another port in a storm.
The fix to this problem? Dream on. That would require quotas for male enrollment in college, non-STEM. Here’s a thoroughly revolutionary concept: Keep the dames out of college. Yeah, I said it.
Here’s a portent of the future for hypergamous female college graduates.
The Private Man 
I don’t think it’s a hypergamy thing. It’s culture. In the country I live in, I reside in the richest area. This area is supporting the rest of the country, and the trades guys and sales guys are the ones making money. Plenty of women with degrees happily married and attracted to these guys.
Don’t kid yourself. If the western world’s economy keeps tanking, it’s the trades guys that will have the advantage. Skip university and the debt. Your money’s better spent becoming a plumber. You’ll never be out of work. A degree is only a hypergamy thing as long as it’s worth something. If you’re making the same or better than the guys with degrees, and over time, the guys with degrees are out of work or earning less, well, you get the idea.
As for the dames not going to college…..women have a heck of a lot of areas that they need to improve upon . Femininity and attractiveness has been touched on this blog. I would say character issues need to be addressed. I just can’t get on board with smooshing them down in order to make men seem grander. It wouldn’t work anyhow. Small men on pedestals are still small men.
It’s a lot easier to become a plumber than it is to gain a STEM qualification.
Who will be making the bucks to pay the plumber, when everyone becomes a plumber?
Exactly. These positions will not be in demand for long, as they fill up inevitably. You always have to be ahead of the curve if you want long term high earning employment, unless you are a woman in academia.
Educated women will gladly take an uneducated man, so long as he earns more money. Mrs. Social Worker who earns 40k will have no problem marrying Mr. Truck Driver who earns 70k.
Either way, the point about hypergamy is still accurate. Women don’t value education in a partner; they value money. Money will always triumph over their educational requirements of men.
This isn’t a cultural thing. This happens all over the world.
That scenario will start playing out more and more once the educated potential husband becomes especially acute. There will be a few years of hand-wringing and exhorting men to “man up and go to college”. But eventually Cosmopolitan magazine will start publishing articles on the virtues of men in the skilled trades and men who operate complex machinery.
Just bear in mind that I’m still reading stories from dating coaches of women who absolutely insist that the man must have an equal or higher education. I also read that in hundreds upon hundreds of dating profiles.
Yes exactly! I’d marry blue collar in a heartbeat. I’m not buying the university degree prestige line (I hate how much I’m spending on my degree). Trades (at least where I live) is where the money is. My dad and all of my uncles are blue collar. If I was a man, I’d get into welding and forget a university degree. You can easily learn the same things on your own time that you would in university (for a lot cheaper.
Almost agree with you, but I think that there is a use for rigorous standard qualififcations in STEM subjects. It says that you have a solid basis of knowledge.
Media studies? no
Sociology? meh
Women’s studies? cut something out of the back of a cornflake packet – just hate men through natural inclination (no student loans required)
Of course if universities debase STEM by quotas for women, requiring lowered standards to keep the male/female ratio. Or just lower standards to get more students through (more profit)…all bets are off. This is the way we (UK) are heading.
I would look at on-line learning as an alternative, if I were in my late teens now. The problem would be proving your level of knowledge for interviews, this is where a degree can help.
Not if you want to become an accredited scientist sweetie. If I want to be a biochemist I have no other choice but going to college.
So you’re not buying those lines which MBA’s without degrees like to say:
“The people under me know their stuff, even if they haven’t been to university”
“Experience counts for more than education”
“What we do in the working world is more advanced than anything you’ve done at the university”
Yes, that’s an attitude that many managers have.
That’s true but I was thinking more non-stem… a degree in history or sociology. (I should have made that more clear)
Here’s a thoroughly revolutionary concept: Keep the dames out of college.
strange times, when common sense is revolutionary
P Ray,
Agreed. So what’s your point?
disregard my comment above, it got posted in the wrong area.
@justvisiting:
“I would say character issues need to be addressed. I just can’t get on board with smooshing them down in order to make men seem grander.”
Equality does or doesn’t exist – just stop telling women what they can or cannot do. Never hold them back. Women can and will make reality – whatever reality they believe exists. Ugh. Gross.
How dare you? Men, all too often, are not important human beings – just another brick the wall. Don’t *ever* let them think they are more that. Remind them of their place – another small man in a large woman’s world.
Oops! Men and women are equal – I forgot!! Somebody, please – please! Call Jezebel – I need my equality bone realigned!!!
Who said any thing about men and women being equal. I don’t agree with quotas or special rights for any one. That includes males who would call them selves men with out the requisite skills. When men can lead again, women will follow.
Just to let you know that Marriage 1.0 is dead.
The whole idea of “women cheat because men don’t lead” is so typically conservative, and the kind of nonsense spewed on Boundless.
P Ray, I’m not talking about those things. You’re making up points to argue.
And banning women from college is typically liberal?
So what aspect of this appeals to you? Dalrock’s crowd seems to think that uneducated young women will better more adoring wives. PM is working the hypergamy issue among other things. And your take? I’m not getting the vibe that you want some doe eyed trembling virgin or could care less about picky spinsters. I suspect that the appeal lies in finding some way to get back at women in general.
Right. ‘Cause any decent man should not have it in his head that when he tries for a relationship, he should be completely naive that everything will turn out for the best? Ignoring what he saw happen to his friends previously, or people he reads about?
Your post above seems like the “you’re just bitter” shaming tactic. Or is it something else, you can clarify.
A P Ray
Not shaming, just curious. See, in my case I’m trying to keep an open mind . I think that if men really thought that it was important to them to have wives that were young and uneducated, they could achieve that through leadership better than bans. Even I would bristle at that.
The thing is, my comments about leadership seem to have you feeling peevish. Like some one is telling you to man up or something. So we get to the crux of what I’m getting at. The only thing that I’m interested in is men and women striving to be the best that they can be. In the case of men, I think leadership is essential to learn and implement in their lives. Without it, a man is going to have a hard time getting and achieving the things that suit his purpose. In many cases, it leave him powerless. So, it’s not about spouting the latest conservative idea of the day. It’s about self development.
Which brings me to wonder why a bunch of pua’s and mra’s could care less about young brides or aging spinsters. It’s not like any of them are going to wife these girls up , so I have to wonder why suggest and support a ban?
I’m not a decision-maker regarding the education of women, so I don’t have to take a position.
But if I had to, I would say women need to be educated, so that while in a relationship but not pregnant or being with their children and raising them – they would financially contribute to the family.
If a man financially supporting a woman is a sign of his love, I think the reverse is also fair. I’m a big believer in equality.
What’s your education level, by the way (Mine is a B.Sc)? And can you return to the workforce? And if you couldn’t … what can you do with your degree that marks you out as self-reliant?
Because women with useless degrees, both burden their husbands/families with the student loans that can’t be forgiven … and are economic liabilities too, since they can’t produce things on their own (handicrafts and knick-knacks typically do not bring in much money … better be a good cook then!)
Both PUAs and MGTOWs/MRAs …
make sure the women unsuitable for marriage, don’t get one. Remember that a nice guy with a slut, is losing his chance at happiness with a nice girl, or being happy alone.
Or do you think that a slut should be married to a nice guy, as compared to a nice girl … since the happiness of a man alone simply can’t be allowed?
I’m of the opinion that an education is only as good as the person using it. My father was pushing me to get into law, mother pushing towards a business degree, and I wanted to go into the sciences. Life has a funny way of happening when you’re not looking.
Enter a young man with a plan and the ability to not be intimidated by my father, and well……the motorcycle probably didn’t hurt. John Hughes would have approved. (But my father certainly did not. Especially when my future husband ran of with his 17 year old daughter.)
University was too expensive, but business was a natural fall back. Both of my parents had been business owners, and I’d grown up apprenticing in business from the time I was 8. It was a pretty easy transition to put together business’ or acquire them. After the arrival of my first two kids, I limited myself to helping my husband set up his business and help him with the details. This allowed me to focus on the home and family. When they got older, I went back to that. Circumstances surrounding the divorce led to a devastating financial situation. With a baby at home, I decided that a home based business would be best. So I buy the electronic rights to books and edit and format to kindle. (Well, there’s more to it than that, but I wont bore you.)
As for the whole sluts not being suitable for marriage, well, I’m not sure. In this day and age, I have an un naturally low number count. Looking at my friends, some with low number counts are just as unsuitable for marriage as those with high. In some cases a man may have an easier time reforming a slut than a repressed wife My best friend from high school racked up a count in the double digits by the time I took off with hubby. I don’t know what the final count was by the time she married at 19, but she and her husband were and are quite happy. I think the ability to physically bond gets messed with and makes it easier to cheat. There are emotional and personality issues that can be affected. Hard to say, it’s not a politically correct area of study. Either way, I’m not into slut shaming or dehumanizing people based on their chastity or lack of it. Male or female. Though I’d personally advise against it.
They are already marrying blue collar. PhD tenure track marrying cook, engineer, male nurse… and that is just in my department…
A couple of observations.
1. The nature of hypergamy will change.
As you pointed out, most of those degrees are worthless now. The education bubble has popped. For both sexes. So women will look for other status markers instead.
2. Women are resigned to the idea of not getting married.
At least they are here in the UK. I speak to lots of women in the 30-45 demographic (I’m 38) and they *know* they are never getting married. That’s true for both the divorcees and the spinsters.
40% of all female UK graduates born since 1970 will never have children, according to Boris Johnson in 2007
It’s more to do with the idea that they don’t want to be with a lesser man, but don’t want to raise the child of an alpha they can’t be in a legal relationship with.
Cohabitation laws in the UK: She can take you for half your worth, if you have been with her for over 2 years.
Also, funny side effect:
If men are becoming more “useless” … where will all the on-call and experienced doctors be coming from again?
Only in Scotland.
“Common Law” marriages are not recognized in England, Wales or Northern Ireland.
However, cohabiting couples are assessed the same as married couples for state benefit purposes.
Doctors are being drafted in from all over the planet in NHS hospitals these days. The sex ratio isn’t that skewed in medicine yet.
You cannot have a stable society which is egalitarian and with most women being hypergamous at the same time. What is happening is that the most genetically capable women (the most intelligent and beautiful), because of this incompatible modern duality, are not finding a mate that satisfies them. You pretty much have to deeply satisfy a woman on an instinctual level (ie fulfill her hypergamy) for her to want to bear you children, and these women are not having children. Is seems inevitable that western culture will be taken over by more patriarchial societies (ie M & M, mexicans and muslims) where men are allowed to lead because their society supresses women’s education and working opportunities. But because these are some of the most intolerant and incurious cultures out there, a new dark ages will come.
And all because western women wanted it all: to be treated like an equal, but still insist on having children with a man that was clearly better than her.
When I finally figured out that what most women really wanted was for a man that was better than her who would treat them like an equal is when I became deeply angry and distrustful of women.
I can accept being better than a woman and supporting her if I knew that if I wanted to, I could direct her life. But now you have to be better than her and pretend that she is an equal to you. That’s the way it is with my current gf–its like Im living in this imaginary world.
This is all going to play out at liberal arts undergraduate college campuses where admissions officers must grapple with the increasingly unbalanced gender ratios. I strongly suspect that many colleges are in a growing panic over these unbalanced ratios.
“Your money’s better spent becoming a plumber. You’ll never be out of work. A degree is only a hypergamy thing as long as it’s worth something. If you’re making the same or better than the guys with degrees, and over time, the guys with degrees are out of work or earning less, well, you get the idea.”
Maybe true for a few women out there. Maybe some educated women may even marry a man that is blue collar, but one thing I have learned is that women often marry man that they decide they will not have children with. And I think in a lot of these couplings the woman may marry, but may hold back on having kids. The reason is because even though he may have some money, he is low status.
Also, I support PM’s sentiment that the dames should be kept out of college. It would be a quick solution that would right a lot what is wrong with western society.
The Chinese government limited personal human rights by demanding that families only can have one child. At the cost of personal rights, this government mandate saved their culture from a Malthusiam over-population crisis and self-destruction. Maybe western gov’ts should limit female education and employment opportunities is women insist on a man that is better than them to have children with.
I think this must be an American mindset. Trades are not sneered at where I live for the simple reason that they out earn most degree holders. Recession, what recession? These guys are head hunted and pursued. My cousin moved to the area I live in by being prospected. On top of which they threw in a house (some of the most expensive real estate in the country), perks, (they even had people find his wife a job in her field) Trust me, status is not an issue. In fact, we had a baby boom out in this area. It’s not uncommon for stem women to be married to these guys. And let’s not forget the alpha component. A lot of these jobs are men only, high risk, and testosterone driven.
Keeping women out of college would be a stupid move. Hell, even I would become a card carrying feminist if Dalrock’s crowd got their way. You’d just end up with more single mothers on welfare, not young wives looking up adoringly at some horrible excuse for masculinity.
Hmmm…. are you in northern Alberta?
Local conditions vis a vis hypergamy do indeed vary. In the typical American city, women seek men of a higher overall “status”, be it expressed with money, education, intelligence, social influence, etc.
Women who are college-bound need to understand the unintended consequences of a college degree and hypergamy – a shortage of suitable (to them) men. It’s just that simple.
It’s definitely localized. In the cities of the US a high-status graduate degree woman (say, lawyer, doctor, professor) is generally not marrying a tradesman. I have worked with dozens of highly educated female lawyers in New York City and Washington DC for the past 20+ years, and I have not known a single one who was married to a tradesman. They are married to other lawyers, doctors, business execs and professors, and, to a much more limited degree, established artists. Not plumbers.
And even if you took away the welfare net, they’d just end up in harems or from guy to guy. There’s a femininity crisis going BECAUSE there’s a masculinity crisis going on. Making men the primary wage earners isn’t going to set the clocks back for the simple reason that beta men are not as masculine as beta men of decades past.
I was fortunate to grow up with a very large extended family on my mothers side. Her mother and father had many brothers. My great uncles would be considered beta males within their time frame.
These men knew how to run a farm (Some with a team of horses) build a barn, build a house, hunt, fish, tear down an engine, plumbing , wiring, fight, and earn money by the time they were 14. They knew how to be self sufficient and earned core confidence from the time they could walk. And many could sit a saddle before that.
They were taught and expected to lead. Lead their live stock with out getting trampled. Lead their wife and family. Lead a troop in war (which all of them did) lead in business and lead in their church and community. They saved the world before the were 30. Many before they were 22.
They walked differently, they talked differently, they carried themselves differently. In fact, minus the harems and pump and dump, they are what is considered alpha today. Why do so many women want an alpha to commit to them? Because they are the place holders of yester years betas.
Some guy brought up on play dates at the park and a bike helmet isn’t going to cut it just because he’s sitting on a pedestal of changed laws.
^ Is this more of the “man up” lines? “Taught to lead … ”
who exactly were they leading? Not everybody’s going to marry a leader …
and if every woman thinks she is,
well, same situation as what we have now.
P Ray, men were taught to lead. Period. In your mind set, that would be alphas. In decades past, that was what all men were taught.
^ If everybody is leading, who is tending the sick? Planting the crops? Burying the dead?
“Alpha” in your definition, seems to be the biggest and most socially dominant male.
@ P Ray
With so many arenas of leadership, take your pick.
I think I’ve been pretty clear on what these men were taught to lead in. They certainly weren’t walking around with fuzzy hats and male polish.
PM , there’s a trend toward these women not using their degrees anyway. We get a lot of pressure to go after them. In my case, I had a very alpha father who did not allow the women in his life to work, but put huge pressure on me to go after a power degree. Add that to a divorced mom who became the worst sort of ball busting feminist, and well, you get the idea. Then there’s a culture and school system that lies to women about their basic natures and you have the situation you have.
I married young, and knew even then, that I wasn’t a feminist, but the terror of not getting my education was deeply ingrained. (Thank god I pursued an alternative.)I even thought I’d have kids and just put them in day care. There was nothing in my life that prepared me for the shock of maternal instinct. And it was a shock. At least with sexual instincts you have indicators of attraction over the years. The agony of having to put my baby in daycare had me sobbing on the floor in a locked bathroom. (And, well, that’s just not my style . Most people who know me would have a hard time visualizing it.) I am forever grateful that my ex approached me about staying home.
The tides are turning. Women are waking up to the lies earlier. The internet helps because they realize that they are not alone and isolated in how they feel. They’re dropping out of the work force earlier, but usually not until they have a degree. I think that will change as the years go on. Not in Metro areas, but the change is coming. In my generation, a girl would never say that when she grew up she would be a homemaker. Many of the girls in my teen age son’s circle are quite vocal about aspiring to that. Still, the pressure is on them to get a degree. Divorce is the main concern.
So where did all the soldiers and farm hands these men were “leading” come from? Were they women? Mexican day laborers who didn’t count as men to these “leaders”? Everyone being a “leader” is like everyone being “above average”.
@ pro male
I answered that question already in my response to P Ray. Pick your arena. They were taught to lead in many areas. In my great uncles lives, they lead in multiple arenas. Others would have chosen one or two. Either way, it would have required leading.
Are you in northern Alberta?
Hmnnnnn……. Yep.
me too! I guess it’s a whole different story here.
Perhaps if we stopped pretending that all degrees have the same value?
What’s that Doris? You have a Wimminz’s Studies BA (bugger all) degree and 30k debts? and you think that gives you higher status than a plumber with his own business and money in the bank? Get the fuck out of here!
The BBC is doing this shit over unemployed graduates; interview a good looking bint who says ‘I have a degree but no-one wants to hire me, it’s a mystery’. Sometimes they slip up and say it’s a eng lit degree – mystery solved as far as I’m concerned. The BBC being full of soft degree, lefty ‘tards doesn’t have any interest in facing reality.
Wimminz’s degrees should (at most) give women status within their coven, that’s it. Don’t be telling men that a soft BA is worth anything more…IMHO
+ 100
Thanks,
I think we could take a big step back from the brink if we just start cutting the bullshit in society. Many people would be hurt in their pride, but isn’t that better than where we’re headed?
The political class would be seen as the worthless hand puppets that they are too, when people put a realistic value on a politix degree
LADIES! DON’T DESPAIR! UNCLE TOM HAS THE ANSWER!
There, there now don’t get all emotional about what mean old privateman has written. He’s a “glass half empty” type-and I’m the overflowing glass itself! It’s going to be ok-and in fact, it’ll be even better!
But first we need to chat. In order for my proposal to work you’ll need to step back and take the broader (and I mean that literally-keep reading) view. We’re going to need you to not so much lower your standards as expand them (nod to “Heaven Can Wait”). Now, I’m proposing you
STRAP-A-HUSBAND! That’s right, I’m telling you gals to go ahead and grab each other. You’ve turned all the available males into a bunch of pussies anyway why not take the next logical step? Look, you’ve been searching for a partner that was just like your best friend in high school, only with a dick-well, now you’ll have him er her. No frustration with endemic male inability to “get” it i e you, no puttng up with his weird moods that he refuses to recognize ‘cuz he’s a guy and won’t accept he even has them-hell, I’m just getting started. Let’s look at the advantages:
1) TOILET SEAT: You’ll never have this issue with a woman. She’ll always leave it down, and she’ll never forget to flush because she’s subliminally proud of having taken a shit large enough to have its own zip code. And no pee all over the mat, floor and wall because he’s too sleepy, lazy or has a hair stuck on his dickhead ruining the angle of his spray and hitting your hair brushes (never knew that happened, did ya’?). This is all “UP” side (pun intended).
2) ORAL SEX: I’ve been married for 30 years so I’ve nearly forgotten all about-wait, it’s coming to me- it’s a funny term, and means the opposite of what it intends-oh yeah, “blow jobs” (are they still called that?). You won’t ever have to even put up with this at all, even before marriage. Plus you won’t have ot lay there while some poor dumb bastard tries to pleasure you, slobbering around like some love starved pound mutt saved from the gas chamber, munching your pussy like it was a ham sandwich, or worse trying to “lick the alphabet” ‘cuz he saw a comedy skit that said you’ll like it but you don’t, in fact by the time he gets to “L” you’re fighting the urge to grab your nail file and plunge it right into the base of nis neck, but you’re afraid he’ll spasm and bite your goddamned clit off. No-you’ll have a pro, you’ll “get one from the woman who owns one”. She’ll now exactly what you need plus you can admire her hot lingerie instead of the gross skidmarked guy underwear you’ll have to wash once he gets his rocks off and falls straight to sleep without cuddling with you.
3) INFIDELITY: Not an issue. If your partner cheats, it’ll be with another lap licker-hell, invite her over for a Tongue-O-Rama. Make a night of it, swap recipes, pop some popcorn-you’ll have plenty of time to talk because you won’t be talking about what a bunch of shitheads us guys are.
4)MARRIAGE: This way you’ll ALL get a chance to get even with your bitch girlfriends that made you buy those horribly shitty looking bridesmaids outfits, the ones that would make a lingerie model look like she stepped out of a Shriner’s night drag show, like the swing shift at a low end Tijuana whore house, in a color that makes you appear not like a young woman but like the “free gift” handed out to everyone who shows up at a Frederick of Hollywood’s marital aid Tupperware house “party” i e the ones yoru girlfriends importune you to attend and then introduce to some pitchwoman or do it themselves (why do you wome put up with those? If I invited a bunch of my guy friend s over to SELL them ANYTHIG, they’d drink all my beer,eat all my food, beat the shit out of me and then stuff whatever the fuck it was I was selling up my ass. And that’d be on a good night).
I’ll leave out the double clothes etc.-too obvious.Kids? Hey, all these loser guys jerking off to porno will be happy to sell it their “junk” to you-it’s about the only way they have to make money anymore if tpm is right.And bonus points:the strap-on itself will give you yet another useless indulgence to spend $ on, one more way to show status at the expense of the other females that you envy/love, as in “She uses the Big Rod-but I’ve got the 8” Black & Decker ‘Widow’s Friend’ with the second “hand” pucker-plunger-IT IS TO DIE!”
Like I said, it’s all good. Well, not all. You’ll need to find someone to take out the trash, some simple tasks. Again, these loser yo-yo fuck guys will come in handy. BTW if you’ve read this far, please go over to hookingupsmart.com and tell Susan you want me to have a column over there. I’ve got lots more to tell you.
with affection
Uncle Tom
I beginning to think that Tom is the “TVM” I see making comments at the kinky lesbian fetish sites I visit.
@NMH
Those be my intitials, and actually it’s my license plate too. But it ain’t me-not yet, Tell me where. I love watching girl-on-girl. Hey and as for lesbians, I always say “If they won’t let you stick ’em, well then watch ’em lick ’em”!
In 5 years, women will have a tough time finding husbands. I look forward to the fact that by this time next year I will be making 80K a year, and I definitely plan on exploiting the hell out of the fact that so many women will be desperate to marry.
Give it 10 years, then the chicken will come home to roost. All those single moms and children of single moms will start hitting the market. It’s going to be a free for all.
Also, the trades seem like a great idea. But someone please correct me if I’m wrong here. The economy is in the shitter, it will continue to be in the shitter, and less and less of your tax dollars will go to actual useful projects (like infrastructure) and more into feel good femme centric programs. I just can’t see there being such a huge demand for plumbers and electricians and whatnot in 5 years, due to the fact that the average person won’t have money to pay for their services. Who will pay the salary of a welder when the factory closes down due to lack of customers?
There is a huge factory in my city, that closed its doors completely about 2 years back when shit hit the fan and they couldn’t keep hemorrhaging money. Literally every worker was fired. Welders, engineers, everyone. I am in Canada mind you, and we came out smelling like a rose compared to everyone else. So I ask again, who will employ these welders? These plumbers? These electricians? No one will be able to afford to pay for their services, because there will not be enough demand.
Keep the dames out of college?
Or, you know, more men could care about going to college. If the sex ratio is 60/40, I can only assume that the men don’t want to be there. In any case, we have enough female professors now that we could go off and found our own rogue colleges if we were proscribed. What would you do then? Send out the National Guard?.
Nice try.
Of course they don’t want to be there (STEM subjects notwithstanding). Contemporary liberal arts colleges are hostile to men. Of course the remaining, attractive, alpha men on campus can really exploit hookup culture at it’s best/worst, at least there’s that for guys.
Yes, please go start your own rogue colleges and universities. Take the political correctness and feminist dogma with you so the legitimate colleges can return to some degree of academic rigor and true critical thinking.
But seriously, how do you propose to close the gap? You’re not going to ban girls from college, although quotas for men would keep some of them out de facto. It seems like the problem lies with divorce and single motherhood – so many boys grow up without a father these days. Then, at the other end, the colleges are infested with marxism, feminism, new historicism, and all the other -isms, most of which were not conceived of by women (I’ll grant you feminism). I would like to think that young men are tuning out because this stuff is too precious to interest them.
I agree that contemporary liberal arts colleges are hostile to men. They tend to be hostile to anyone with morals and sanity. I wanted a real liberal arts education, so I chose a rigorous, traditional school and majored in Classics; and I would recommend this path to anyone desiring a humanities degree with actual substance behind it. No matter where you go, it’s hard to fake knowledge of Greek and Latin.
The oil industry isn’t going away any time soon. And entire industries of welders, oil rig guys, machinists and boiler makers orbit it.
Speaking of oil, head to North Dakota, guys, they are crying out for men to work in the oil fields! Make enough to pay off those ridiculous college loans for that worthless degree you’ll probably never use. Almost no women work out on the rigs (no gubmint ownership/no affirmative action out there); it’s truly a man’s world and you’ll make far more money than a cubicle drone.
ND was my home state and trust me, there’s no Sex and the City, Eat, Pray, Love, Pampered Princess of Cupcake culture on the prairie.
“but our society doesn’t allow for much cross pollination among socioeconomic strata”
Bitches better get real and learn how to deal! The yuppified, SAHM, yoga class, ladies bookclub, McMansion lifestyle is going, going, about to be gone for all but a few.
PM, this post is right on. A full third of female college graduates in this generation will not marry college educated men. I agree with you – that’s going to mean a lot more spinsters. Some women, a minority, would be amenable to marrying men in the trades, but our society doesn’t allow for much cross pollination among socioeconomic strata, except possibly via online dating.
BTW, the national college ratio today is 57% F, 43% M, and that is overall – including STEM. We have a serious problem with our young men not going to college. I have often said that a society whose men are not thriving cannot survive for long. We must address what young males are experiencing – marriage, the family and even the economy depend on it.
Yeah, we need men to go to college so they can work for women. Come on guys. MAN UP because there are women with lots of bills expecting you to pay them. If you don’t MAN UP, I’m going to keep telling you to MAN UP until you do.
Well…if you’re sure that it’ll work…
I think we’re hearing socons getting a bit strident because that shit is past its sell by date…or I hope that it is
I agree, Susan. The upthread stuff about Northern Alberta is inapposite. Applicable in that context, sure, but Northern Albertan oil rigs are not Boston, NYC, Toronto, Vancouver, DC, Dallas, etc. So not very revealing. As I said, I know no woman among my lawyer colleagues who is married to a plumber (or similar).
Tide may be turning, just visiting, but there are many more people in my non-turning tide than there are in yours.
I think the difference is that the class distinctions are blurred here. The brightest and the best who could very easily go to university are choosing not to because the money is better. Also, many that did get degrees, opted to go into trades because the money is better. Throw in university educated wives and girl friends, and you have a situation that may be different. I’m getting the impression that in other areas, these guys are neanderthals.
If you read Allie’s earlier posts, she mention’s something that is so normal to us, but perhaps not other places. She mention’s that guy’s should go into trades because they can learn the university stuff on their own time. This is normal here, as voracious self learning is part of the culture. I think this also might be because the class distinctions are blurred. Trade guys perhaps feel a bit of the keeping up with the jones’ vibe.
Just how high status is a doctorate in sociology, 50k debts and no job, nor prospect of one beyond waitressing?
Now the hamster will a-spin for a few years, but come the baby-rabies, what then?
‘settle’ for a ‘loser’ man with income but no degree, couple of kids (‘whoops’ or agreed), then divorce rape and tragic tale of ‘he just weren’t man enough’
Men don’t do it! Marriage is a trap!
You don’t need to be a “brightest” or a “best” to do a bachelor’s in the arts.
Just get your manhating on and spout illogical arguments.
Toss in some electives of child- and aged-care, and that’s your degree done.
How difficult a degree is, is an inverse measure of how often the person can afford to be a slacker yet still get through.
Social sciences, business, communications, marketing, management and psychology majors from what I saw, are the biggest slackers.
The man is going to notice that he is being taken for a ride if the woman who likes him cannot account for her previous years … or is well past her previous attractiveness when she decides “he is good enough for me to be married to”.
That problem can be solved if many of those teenage girls stopped going to university and instead married older mid-20’s men. But of course you didn’t propose that solution. If those females actually cared about their society, they would do just that. The truth is they don’t care about society. These young American women only care about themselves.
@Susan
I had not even thought of this until I read your post, but another limitation for a woman marrying a man of lesser formal education, or with a “trades” when she is in the “managerial” class, is what I’ll describe as the intra-male implied putdown. You get a gathering of upper middle class types (you know what I mean) and then put a carpenter, plumber etc. in with that group, I dont care what he makes or whether he can wax eloquent on early Etruscan flying phallic symbols, a lot of the guys will be like the prick on the “Titanic” who made Decaprio feel like a shitheel. Insecurity runs this planet; and the woman who is the spous eof this guy will feel it too. It’ll never happen; handymen dont marry the people who hire them. So upper middle calls educated ladies in you late 20s early 30s, get used to using Big Wally the 18 battery super-dildo, going out with like situated females, and getting mercy fucked in your 50s by Viagra laden wig wearing overweight Lotharios with bleached teeth.
With regards to the gender ratios in the STEM fields, this is a cut and paste from Alpha game:
” INCREASING the number of women in science and technology has been an important goal for universities and industries, and substantial progress has surely been made. More women than ever major in so-called STEM fields. Still, women earn only 17 to 18 percent of the bachelor’s degrees in engineering and computer science, and just over 40 percent in the physical sciences and math. Where are the women? Clustered in the life sciences. About 58 percent of all bachelor’s, master’s and doctorates in biology are awarded to women.”
Here is the link related to the above quote:
http://alphagameplan.blogspot.com/2011/11/we-already-know-answer.html
Yes I guess the “the alberta advantage” really does exist. Its just seems so normal/why I couldn’t understand every aspect of the manosphere till today.
My biggest concern is dating a guy who is married in another province/has a family (its been known to happen).
Gotta watch those guys coming in to work from out east.
Yes! Especially the maritimes! It’s hard to catch.
Especially the Maritimes. More than their fair share of testosterone.
Got watch those Charlottetown guys veeerrryyy carefully………..
Anyway, if anybody thinks that a STEM degree is a sure path to good money and a hot wife, look at your individual STEM field very carefully. In the Biomedical Research Sciences, hiring has leveled off, and the pharmaceutical industry has been laying off people because large blockbuster drugs have been going off patent over the past few years and will continue. Academic research is likely to lay off more people as NIH funding is flat right now and likely to decline. I cannot speak for other STEM fields but hiring in the biomedical research fields in the US is definately in decline. Things will only get worse.
Probably time for me to quit, due more Dead Lifts and Squats, move to either Williston or Edmonton, and get me a real job working rigs.
And there, I will have no choice but to pork prostitutes for the rest of my life.
Then again, maybe TVM will help me recruit ladies for hot lesbian fetish pornography. Better dust off that Super 8.
Aren’t you the guy who hasn’t been able to find thin, sexy hot women in your current locale? Work for five years on the Bakken Field (ND), expat to Thailand and enjoy warm climes and hot young babes for the rest of your life (after a few NoDak winters, you’ll appreciate the tropics!).
http://www.rockinthebakken.com/
@NMH
Hmnnn…….from the maritimes perhaps?
What you’re saying about the Biomedical Research fields is scary. I guess I figured that even in bad economic times that they’d be immune to it.
From just visiting: “These men knew how to run a farm (Some with a team of horses) build a barn, build a house, hunt, fish, tear down an engine, plumbing , wiring, fight, and earn money by the time they were 14. They knew how to be self sufficient and earned core confidence from the time they could walk. And many could sit a saddle before that.
They were taught and expected to lead. Lead their live stock with out getting trampled. Lead their wife and family. Lead a troop in war (which all of them did) lead in business and lead in their church and community. They saved the world before the were 30. Many before they were 22.”
From Nummm: The economy is in the shitter, it will continue to be in the shitter, and less and less of your tax dollars will go to actual useful projects (like infrastructure) and more into feel good femme centric programs. I just can’t see there being such a huge demand for plumbers and electricians and whatnot in 5 years, due to the fact that the average person won’t have money to pay for their services. Who will pay the salary of a welder when the factory closes down due to lack of customers?
From TPM and others: acknowledgement that hypergamy varies by geographical location
These ideas should be addressed together. Where I live, many of the men still do build, hunt, fish, grow food, do their own mechanic work and fix stuff around the house, farm etc. Welding is an occupation and also something that guys learn to do because it’s just a good skill to have. In fact all of the things I just mentioned, are the same basic things that just visiting brought up. Wanna know why? In many places, it is an unwritten rule that *these are the things that men do*.
I don’t think that you can use education as a yardstick to measure alpha/beta when it comes to these types of skills. In fact, I will take blue collar over a biochemist any day. If (or when) SHTF economically, who will still be able to protect and provide for their family? THAT is what the alpha/beta thing is really all about (IMHO).
The feminist agenda screwed the whole thing up, not just the balance of power in male/female relationships. The men referenced above, the ones who can do all that man-stuff, they expect women to do the things that their mothers and grandmothers did. Yes, you can have a job, (you go, girl) BUT you also need to cook, clean, and tend the garden in addition to raising the kids.
The general lack of respect for others that is ingrained in so many people through our educational system, tv, etc. is destroying our ability to form lasting relationships. If people are waking up to it and turning to more traditional roles, that is wonderful! Too bad that people my age got caught up in the brainwashing… men think that pump and dump is OK because women don’t need them anyway, and women have been led to believe that men are expendable or unnecessary, but a degree and career aren’t.
I agree; I think that women will go for alpha even if a bachelor’s degree is not involved.
I think the worst think about a female-heavy campus is not that it encourages women to snub men without degrees–the danger is that women will simply be less likely to find mates in their social circles during their college years. College is a prime window of opportunity to make friends and start an LTR, and if their classes and campus setup isolate them from contact with townies, a bunch of women are just going to miss out on that. Still, if they reach out aggressively after graduation, they can make up for lost time. But they will need to move faster than they think.
The other danger is that the hookup culture will train women in bad romantic habits. Hookups are terrible preparation for marriage. I’ve seen some bloggers like Roosh advise women to get their fun out of the way in college and immediately move on to looking for an LTR–awful advice. It’s like telling girls to eat all the ice cream they want in college, so they can “get their fat phase out of the way,” and then slim down after they graduate. No-strings sex with bad boys prepares you for more no-strings sex with bad boys.
So my advice for women at man-scarce colleges is:
1. Keep your knees together. The value of those alpha boys is inflated because of their scarcity. You are not playing from a place of strength.
2. Find out where the townies are.
3. Be open to dating men with some or no college experience. If things get serious and you have serious qualms about how his lack of credentials will affect his future financial health, encourage him to get an A.A., attend community college, something. If he wants to marry you, the prospect of supporting a family may be just the nudge of motivation to grit his teeth and get the damn piece of paper. But again, times are changing and maybe the degree would not be worth it.
@flirtyintrovert:
Good advice for college age women! That “damn piece of paper” isn’t any indicator of earning potential here.
What do you think about finding a man in a man-scarce rural town where the single men my my age range all seem to be severely damaged or just plain cads?
@LadySadie: well, if moving isn’t an option…
1. Online dating.
2. Do you have interests and hobbies that you find especially exciting? Find out where the conventions/conferences/workshops happen, and see if you can meet some like-minded friends there.
3. Any expedition that takes you away from Rural Town and into the path of eligible men… but preferably through your friends and family in other locales. Like say you have a friend in San Francisco, and you go out to visit her, and you get to meet her local friends. Just like the conference thing, though, visiting your friend is something you would do for its own sake, not just to meet men.
Awesome advice.
Ha seriously, northern Alberta evidence that women will go against hypergamy and marry tradespeople? The place where I worked for one year on the pipeline to pay for my bachelors back here in the farming south? Ft.Mac is the centre of Canadian hypergamy. The only women there are strippers and giant fatties, all the high earning men have brutally ugly wives and girlfriends. Anywhere else they’d be dating much hotter women.
In other words, the women in No. Alberta are, on average, such low class or low attractiveness, that even dating a garbage collector is a step up in status. So women are hypergamous by default, being the bottom feeders they are st this location (of course, this may not apply to JV and her friends).
Men in the west cannot win.
Fort mac is a gongshow. I won’t lie about that, but the guys I know who do work up there do four on/one off and then go back to their families in other parts of the country. Big sacrifice for the dollar (their wives aren’t disgusting.. Far from it).I have no idea what the women are like in fort mac looks wise… I don’t live there.
I’ll second Allie. Most of these guys are flying in to Fort Mac or the camps for their shifts and then back to their communities for the shifts they have off.
I can’t comment on Fort Mac. Never been there, but I imagine that it could have a bit of a boarder town effect. There’s going to be spin offs on having a lot of testosterone driven young men all in one area with their pay cheques burning a hole in their pockets. Prostitution, drinking,strippers,drugs…..
A lot of the camps have the men flown directly in and directly out. I suspect that it’s just easier to keep the peace that way.
Thanks @ flirtyintrovert. You gave some very nice advice. It’s a little more complicated than you imagine, but I appreciate your opinion, all the same.
BTW, I am a mother of three and my hobby (that doesn’t revolve around my kids) is “Quick-Draw” shooting, and the pathways out of this town are few and pricey considering the costs of a babysitter.
You are very sweet to take the time to respond. I will think about everything you said!
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“The fix to this problem? Dream on. That would require quotas for male enrollment in college, non-STEM. Here’s a thoroughly revolutionary concept: Keep the dames out of college. Yeah, I said it.”
No, no, no!
🙂
PM, I have been a lurker on your site for a while and I usually agree with you on most things.
But I think with respect to the above, the solution is NOT to restrict women’s entry to college. No, we need highly educated women. All we need to change is ‘attitude’ towards men. Respect for men is lacking in the modern world, yes. Your site and many others are redressing the balance. Slowly.
Do check out my new blog. I am kinda continuing your work, but from a slightly dfferent angle, from a female ‘red pill’ point of view.
It simply can’t happen because hypergamy is a hard-wired characteristic in a woman’s DNA. Biology always wins.
PM, you are not wrong…
But you are not entirely right either.
Women who have a good baseline repect for men, once they understand waht’s going on in the SMP are incredibly receptive to change. Don’t underestimate the woman’s need to get a man. Remember that a woman’s imperative is to get her man.
Biology at work again 🙂
Why esle are dating coaches targeting them?
Also, the impact of the economic situation nowadays (where degrees don’t mean much anymore, I think several commenters above have made this point) is to make the tradesman suddenly the desired guy no matter how well educated the woman…
No, a woman’s biological imperative is the snag the best man’s DNA and that’s where hypergamy comes in. You’re still thinking in the context of agricultural/industrial societies. It was during the hunter/gatherer age when female mating and reproductive strategies evolved.
A woman’s college education simply winds up her rationalization hamster so that she believes she’s more intelligent than guys without those vaunted college degrees.
In about five years, I predict much wailing and gnashing of teeth in the mainstream media regarding the “husband shortage”. Men, of course, will be blamed.
I have noticed that women become more lax with their educational requirements of men as long as the man is earning more. What woman with an elementary education degree would turn down a high school educated contractor who earns 100k? In the end, it all boils down to money. The idea that women want educated men is a myth. Women want educated men only if they have incomes that are equal or greater than their own. A man with a fluff degree who works at Best Buy does not have the advantage over a high school educated man who works in a trade. In that respect, women are rarely willing to marry down economically. In the end, the two groups that will suffer the most are upper tier women and lower tier men. But education being a deciding factor? No way.
I just can’t wait to see what happens over the next 40 or so years. It will be the ultimate social experiment. Will future women do what men have done for centuries, which is to *gasp* marry-down economically? Although I can’t predict the future, I am still going to place my bets on the assumption that they will not marry-down. From what I have observed, women will exhaust all options — including the option of being forever single — before they would even remotely consider marrying-down. In every nation, women marry-up. To believe that this global phenomenon was caused by social conditioning would make one a pretty ‘special’ conspiracy theorist. The day we start acknowledging that men and women are naturally different will be the day that we can start moving forward. We are animals, get over it.
I have a master’s degree, and wouldn’t care at all about marrying a man who didn’t go to college or finish as long as he was smart and knew what he wanted in life and wasn’t afraid to go after it. Many of my friends with degrees would say the same. Your claim that a woman has to marry a man with more education than her is silly and unfounded. What women want are real men, which has almost nothing to do with having a degree, and certainly doesn’t seem to be in abundance in this weird little world of blogs written by men who do nothing but complain about women and make demands from cyberspace.
If by “marry down” you mean “marry a broke loser with no ambitions” then yes, women with standards will never do that. Hopefully.
You’re an egregious liar and your lie is based on social expectations.
Many of your friends will lie quite happily about the kind of men they would date. But in the weird world of online dating that such women inhabit, they are looking for men who are taller, more educated, and more affluent than they are.
Of course, they will never admit it in public. They will simply skip over online dating profiles where the men don’t have the same education.
“Marry a broke loser with no ambitions” is woman-speak for a man with less education, less height, and less income.
But thanks for playing along.
Maybe taller and more affluent, but you are wrong about more education. And plenty of women have no problem admitting this. I actually would avoid a man with more education than me, because I don’t care for intellectuals.
Don’t call me a liar. I am alarmingly honest about what I want in a man and never hesitate to say what it is.
Who are “such women”?
You may not like an intellectual, because he will probably be able to spot inconsistencies in your arguments or win in a debate against you AND (horrors) not be attractive to OTHER WOMEN.
I’m pretty sure in a discussion of public policy, you wouldn’t mind being defeated in an argument with George Clooney.
Oh yeah HORRORS that a woman would want to be with someone attractive! And I dated a man with a phd for two years and never-not-once was he able to beat me in an argument.
I don’t mind being defeated in an argument at all. Give me a man who can make his case without flinging out absurd, imaginary situations and using the age-old “you’re being emotional” for lack of real substance. Show me where I’m wrong without feeling the need to insult me, my intelligence, or my womanhood and you will earn my respect. Most men with your attitude fail on all these counts and end up being your own worst enemies.
Your thin-skinned-ness is noted. ^ Did you get insulted? It’s hardly an absurd, imaginary situation; I am sure Mr. Clooney would appreciate being spoken to like an adult, and he is hardly “not-reachable” since you have the power of Google at your hands to reach his agent.
Your intelligence gets called into question the moment you put forward a premise as the only true thing there is out there.
And I’m fully aware that you can use the “I feel insulted” line to excuse any time a man gains a victory in speech over you …
so that you can then say “I’m not speaking with you because you made me mad”.
Women like you, are their own worst enemy.
I guess I see it as a summation of qualities: Male (income + height + education + what-the-fuck-ever women’s value)>>> Female (income + height + education + what-the-fuck-ever women’s value) for a woman to want to fuck him. So maybe the education requirement can drop if he is overwhelming in other qualities.
But an egregious burden is on the man and it is understandable if he says fuck this and goes NAWALT. If women didnt go to college though it would be relatively easy to satisfy her hypergamy.
Yeah, if women lowered their standards even more it would be easier on you guys and you would basically not have to make any effort at all.
This is why it’s hard to women to find husbands. Because there aren’t a whole lot of (real) men around. Fortunately, there are some, and I think they would laugh at the ideas being present here.
Women can’t find husbands because of their own hypergamy andthat’s biological wired into their DNA. And women don’t set the standards for who a real man is, other men do that. Guys who know and practice Charisma don’t really put much effort into finding women because womentend to throw themselves at those kind of guys. Perhaps those are the “real men” that you speak of? Here’s a novel thought, what do you offer a man (that he wants)to motivate him not to be lazy when he attempts to court you?
The men you are complaining about are the men most in demand.
Apex fallacy much?
As a woman past her university days, I am very sure you had plenty of offers to begin a relationship while growing up.
Maybe looking back you should have taken up one of them.
Women “lower their standards” for men OTHER WOMEN FIND ATTRACTIVE.
That is a very important sentence that you have left incomplete.
You wouldn’t tolerate guff from a guy in a chicken suit … until years later you discovered he was Brad Pitt.
Opps. I meant MGTOW. Im getting my acryonyms confused. Need more coffee.
Let me put it this way, privateman. First of all, you just contradicted yourself, because first you said women don’t set the standards of how men should be men (which I don’t necessarily disagree with) then you turned right around and said “So what are YOU doing to motivate these men to be men.” So which is it? Are men deciding how to be men, or are they following the lead of women who motivate them?
Secondly, I am confident that I can bring a lot that is worthwhile to a relationship. You can take my word for it or not. I’m a big believer in traditional marriage and dating, and none of that includes women advertising themselves, so that’s all I’m going to say on the topic, except in a general way that if a woman finds a good man she should make sure that she treats him well. But only if he proves himself to be a good man first.
Thirdly, I don’t understand the obsession with hypergamy. Let me tell you what I look for in a man. I look for one who can do things that I can’t do. I can get a master’s degree, could go further in academia than that if I wanted to, can win an online argument–all kinds of amazing and wonderful and mostly useless things. So I’m not impressed by a guy who can do the same. I’m impressed by a guy who can build a house, ward off an intruder, fight a war, even (to a lesser extent) do engineering and computerly type things. Women look for protection from men: this is why men end up thinking women only care about money, status, height, all the while completely missing the point that it’s what all those things represent that women are really looking for. Women want men that they need for the things they themselves can’t do. And what’s so bad about that?
It’s truly unfortunate that some women throw themselves at worthless men. I wish that wasn’t the case but obviously it happens. I never claimed that all women have common sense.
You’re impressed by a guy who can do the things you can’t.
The problem is, such a guy is looking for the girl who can do the things he can’t.
Oops.
And most women really are superficial.
Here is a little experiment for you to try:
Go to the shopping complex and see all the couples.
99.999999% will have the guy taller than the girl.
And since women choose to be in relationships (more than men),
who’s being superficial here?
You can change your looks naturally (through diet and exercise), but height is really one of those things you can’t (unless you’re willing to have your bones broken and re-formed, living with metal rods for the rest of your life).
And why do you say “oops” and imply I can’t do things that men can’t do, either? There are lots of things I can do that at least some men can’t. I’m certainly not sitting around worrying about it.
You can’t do things that men can’t do (or rather to a level where you can make a living) – e.g. brain surgery (how many unqualified brain surgeons do you know?)
Heck, even I can’t do that.
On the other hand, being kind to others or reciprocating interest, doesn’t discriminate between genders.
You better sit around worrying about that; what you can fix is more important that what you can’t.
I get it. You’re after the tech millionaire.
I’m getting there, but would only be willing to share it with girls just out of high school, and without past relationships, for the simple reason that I believe that virginal women should be matched with virginal men, since that builds strong families.
I am sure you can agree with that, right, Io?
Or would you prefer a man to spread his seed (read: wealth) to others as a habit, so that you have a chance to get some for yourself?
Girls just out of highschool? Are you a pedo? You sound really insecure. You also shouldn’t advertise yourself as a virgin; you might attract some creepers. Just a friendly warning.
Anyway, a lot of women do prefer tall men, but a lot of men probably also wouldn’t want a woman to be taller than them. However, my sister-in-law is a bit taller than my brother, and they’re very happily married. I personally am both small and thin, so I’m not that interested in excessively tall men. It’s just not something I worry about if I find him attractive in other ways. In fact I would prefer that a man be at least reasonable close to my height rather than, say, 6’3.”
It’s also my understanding that women who are very tall and/or muscular have a hard time finding partners. So are men just as superficial as women? Maybe everyone is a bit superficial?
It looks like Io cannot get enough of us misogynists. Behind that college-educated “strong-independent-women (TM)” veneer lies a woman who desperately wants to be dominated and directed by a man.
Io: I fully don’t intend to pay for your relationship mistakes with others, with my own life.
You’re not being very Catholic with what you say. You sound downright worldly (read: hypocritical) – not like what you say on your blog at all! As in … “I want to behave irreligiously, but then tell others that they need to be pious”.
You seem really insecure; are you denying men the right to choose their partners based on how much sex or relationships she had previously? You must have missed the idea that it is harder for a stable relationship to endure when people have moved from partner to partner.
So basically you want a guy that can do everything you can do, and then even more stuff you cannot do. If this is the case, he is better than you. Do you really deserve a man that is better than you?
I suggest that if you want a man that is better then you, than he has the right to treat you less than his equal, because you would not be that in the relationship. In fact you may need to slut it up in some fashion, Ms. Io.
Slut it up? What on earth are you talking about?
No, I don’t want a man who can do everything I can do. In fact, I’d like to think a man would at least in part like me for being able to do some things that he can’t do or possibly isn’t good at. It wouldn’t really be that big of a deal, though.
What is it with you people and the power struggle? Why not look for a relationship where you both bring things of value and respect each other for it, instead of obsessing over who is “better”?
And the whole premise of your comment is based on nothing, because I have been repeating until I’m blue in the face that I wouldn’t care if a man had less education than me.
Lets say for the sake of argument that you are being intellectually honest when you say a man does not have to have the same educational traits that you have to be attractive to you; however, you admitted that those things are ‘mostly useless’ to you, so they have no value to you. So you want things from a man that are truely of value to you from a man, like his ability to protect you, fix stuff, etc. Now, lets look at the opposite direction. If you cannot protect someone, build a house, fix stuff, then what the fuck can you do that would be of value to a man? In fact, there is extremely little the average woman,like you, can bring to a man except maybe sex that is of value. So even if you are not lying, the man still brings you more than he gets from you. Why do you deserve this? Why should you be treated as an equal by a man that is clearly better than you, because he has more value than you? You need to think about this, dear Io, because you and your silly blog about your insipid travel musings are not enough to give any added value to a man.
The idea that I have nothing to give except sex is your perverted viewpoint, and far from the truth. Thanks for taking the time to read my blog.
I said it once, I will say it again. I know that I have a lot to offer in a relationship; I would prefer to be with a man who also has a lot to offer. This is what most normal, non-bitter, non-grasping people want.
You’re dull. I’ve argued with much smarter and more eloquent misogynists than you. Ho-hum.
What exactly are you bringing to the life of a single guy, that he cannot do for himself or find online?
A man with a lot to offer (to women who can think straight) … is a man who gets a lot of offers.
You either have to be better than all of them, or be able to get plenty of offers of your own.
Ho-hum.
You better ask the four guys who are pursuing me right now.
Pimple-faced pizza delivery boys chasing you down to get a tip don’t count.
Oh and since you seem to have missed it, when I referred to “amazing and wonderful and mostly useless things,” I was being a bit tongue-in-teach. My education has not been worthless in the slightest. I just want a man who can do things I could never do. I wonder why you keep trying to find an insult in that?
Judging from your blog, I would say you got your BS in geography. Yep, that’s really exciting to a man and is really going to improve the world, especially when you make posts on how you feeeel about it.
Oh gosh this is boring.
No, I didn’t major in geography.
Why do you think you deserve a man with a lot to offer when your blog suggests that you are self-absorbed with a very low tolerance for mediocrity, ala Elizabeth Gilbert? What man with a lot to offer is going to bother with trying to keep you interested? You’re not worth it.
Oh gee I feel so woooooorthlesssss now….
I’m sorry for whatever happened to you that made you so bitter. And I had no idea who Elizabeth Gilbert until I googled her name. You should probably find some better reading material.
“Pimple-faced pizza delivery boys chasing you down to get a tip don’t count.”
One is a corporate lawyer and one is a offshore engineer. Now what could I POSSIBLY have to offer men like that?
Good for you, I notice you never mentioned anything about their character. I’m gathering that you like being pursued, and by more men the better. So you are “auditioning” them before you decide?
I hope you don’t get mad if you later discover they are also “auditioning” you. Equality and all that.
Hmmm..the corporate lawyer and engineer are not exactly known for being good with their hands and buildng and fixing stuff, like houses, which is what you claim you want in a man. In fact, these suitors which you appear to consider worthy stand out by needing advanced degrees to get their status that you covet. So apparently education in a man IS important to you, and this proves that you are intellectually dishonest. As PM said in first place, Io, you are a liar. An egregious liar.
Now shut the fuck up and go muse about some stupid trip you want to make.
Io is the classic perfectionist, She wants the perfect man that can do everthing from building a house to have a Masters Degree(she has one) or higher, you are chasing a ghost, and the poor 4 guys that are traying so hard to get to you don’t know that they are in for a long nightmare. A man that can do everthing is a myth. Nobody is perfect including you IO.
How about you go back to your sad little life and your sad little video games, nerd-boy? I know your type.
Referree blows the whistle… “Angry, male-demeaning insult delivered in lieu of logical rebuttal, 15 yard penality and tacit admission that original point was actually correct.”
Ha ha ha. Sad indeed. “You are not being looooogical” “tell me I’m riiiight.”
What is a logical rebuttal to the idea that an engineer doesn’t know how to build stuff? Even though he spends his life building stuff? Why don’t you tell me what the “logical” reply to that is?
And you males have demeaned yourselves on this pathetic little bitter blog, deary.
Now I’m just taunting you, and should know better, but you are truly the worst examples of manhood I’ve come across in a long time and it’s all a bit fascinating.
And surely you know, NMH, that many engineers don’t have advanced degrees. The one I’m talking about doesn’t. So it is you who are the “egregious liar.”
Got anything else?
Im no longer responding to you. You are clearly a self-absorbed attention whore who argues without any intellectual honesty.
Don’t let the you-know-what do you-know-what to your you-know-what on the way out.
Women with degrees that marry down do so out desperation and lack of good choices because their personality sucks. If she has a degree more than likely she wants somebody with similar views that can talk about something and have common goals. To rest importance to a good college degree, like, Masters in Engineering, law or Medicine is stupid, and the person that does so is in denial of reality. I don’t picture and Intelectual woman happy in a relationship with a plumber. She would better off with somebody alike, and if something needs to be fixed in the house, pay the plumber and end of the story.
Both genders marry up. Women marry up in finances & men marry up in physical appearances.
[Men are also very cognizant of just how beautiful a woman he can marry. Women don’t seem to be as aware of the relationship market value, if at all aware.]
I don’t think there’s going to be a huge husband storage as studies have that both genders are increasingly less interested in relationships and marriages with women being in the lead of the disinterest. It’s even happening in other countries take Japan though it’s 36% young men/59% young women being indifferent or averse to sex, relationships, and marriages with the opposite sex.
[It’s an interesting social trend and one that bears watching. Certainly spinsters over a certain age are quite willing to rationalize away their station in life and augment that rationalization with lots of activities, friends, extended families, and pets.]
Another bump in the husband shortage is that people aren’t limited to those in their country. If such a shortage existed the men who were unwanted & women who didn’t find what they wanted could just try different countries.
[Marrying someone from outside the country is quite the difficult process for an American, regardless of gender. Perhaps in the Euro-zone it might be easier.]
A thoroughly revolutionary concept: Keep the lads in college.
In the USA studies have shown that men drop out of college at a disproportionate amount and have lower grades than women.
[Great idea. Let’s start by making colleges less hostile to the lads. Maybe when young men aren’t accused of being potential campus rapists they might feel a stronger connection with higher education. Perhaps the classes can be restructured to be less passive and more active. North American campus life isn’t exactly pro-male.]
Rather than have a revolutionary concept keep one gender down just so guys can have more of a chance of partners why not improve where men are lacking. It is lacking to me as I’m uninterested in feminism/liberalism/whatever blaming conspiracy theories for those shortcomings. Just like I’m uninterested in fast food chain blaming conspiracy theories for fatness in America.
[I’m mostly with you on this one. Blame is mostly pointless but it does serve to prevent those responsible for continuing to make shitty decisions that impact society in a negative way. Do you want McDonalds to hire lobbyists when FDA legislation is created?]
I guess you’re not to complain if a woman decides to marry a guy solely to use him to provide for her. As the whole basis of keep the dames out of college is so that the man will make more than her thus she’ll be more inclined to choose him.
[Keeping the dames out of college fits right in with the DNA of hypergamy. As well, if she’s giving him something he desires – respect, sexuality, a pleasant home atmosphere – he likely won’t feel so exploited and will be more motivated to keep up his end of the bargain to maintain the relationship. Unless, of course, she’s only attracted to alpha cads.]
I also guess you’re not to complain if women came up with the revolutionary concept: Keep guys from choosing based on physical attraction. Just to help out the unfortunate looking/weight girls and girls who feel it’s unfair or a disadvantage that generally/biologically men approach based on appearances.
[Contra naturam. As hypergamy is hard-wired, so is a man’s desire for youth and beauty. Biology always wins.]
Long one here.
Both genders tend to overprice themselves. Studies have shown that the majority of men go for the top most attractive whole. Note “go for” not that guys are attracted to but that they pursue. In American society generally guys are taught they can buy beauty via personality/charisma/confidence/money/etc, looks matter less for them, and that women look for deeper things. Dating advice is not how to get a girl in your league but how to get hot young(er) girls. Most guys aren’t trying to get a plain jane or the American average (which is a fattie) they’re trying to get an attractive girl and generally that means more attractive than himself.
Is this spinister rationalization just for the women or are you including men in the term spinister? As for over a ceratin age the studies weren’t done on aging or middle age wo/men I clearly put it was done on young men and women. Perhaps we have different definitions of young it was done on 20s in America and the ones in Japan was done on teens. There were teens surveyed in America on repeat stuides with the results being very similair. Disinterest/aversion of the opposite gender for realtionships, marriage, and even sex seems to be because some find other things more fulfilling in life.
Euro-zone would definitely be easier and certainlyy less competition for American males with the incorrect generalization we’re feminists. Something mighty helpful in populated areas where women feel the men are abusive. It may not be easy but it is a feasible option that takes relocation and learning a new language and culture.
I’m not buying the whole all/most colleges are hostile to guys. Most guys that aren’t in the science field are slackers and the ones outof college are either financial reasons or they didn’t make well enough grades in high school. Most that are in college are in community college I’m not slamming community colleges as many bright guys & gals go there but plenty more guys in community college but most guys I know go there because there grades weren’t good enough for a university. The end result of the community colelge is pretty much the same as university guys they most either drop out or bomb out. It wasn’t hostile environment as most didn’t attend college and when they did it was a half-ass effort or they weren’t simply prepared (kuds sucky education system for passing on those who shouldn’t be promoted)
Where are the stats/studies on the whole potential campus rapist accusation keeps guys away from college? Most guys I know fear false rape accusations not being. Then again most guys I know are aware that men rape, to other wo/men we are strangers, and our parents taught that trust is earned. While not assuming the worst I’m not assuming that everyone is automatically incapable of doing no wrong. Humans are rapists so men are rapists and women are rapists. I’m unsure of what you mean by accused. I’m going with guys being viewed like they could be a rapist. Not everyone is trusting and suggesting that men don’t be viewed as of being potential campus rapists by strange wo/men is it overlooks the fact that men do rape because humans rape.
North American campus life isn’t pro-introvert. It’s very pro-male & pro-female in my experience the pro-male part so much so that parties, clubbing, socializing, and f*cking is why a lot of university guys bomb out.
The difference with your question is that the McDonalds corp would have a impact on the government to continue serving it’s food. I have yet to see any non blame shifting feminism/liberalism/etc conspiracy theories but proven factual laws for colleges where all or the majority are hostile to guys more than gals. Another difference is that even with McDonalds lobbyists people can still choose to eat healthy adn exercise. While the guys will be screwed out of an education unless they choose to go overseas.
“Keeps the dames out of college” It fits into hypergamy by vastly lowering the standards of what makes a quality man. It’s like a teacher seeing 1/2 class fail and the other 1/2 proceed to the next grade so they decide next time around to give bonus points to the failing types and hinder the successful ones. The better option to me rather than shortchanging the succeeding half and lowering the standards for the failrues would be to ensure the failures succeed. It’s nothing short of if women went on a fat/ugly strike and got unattractive because they found it unfair men go for young & pretty. We’d still go for the most attractive but we’d know she isn’t really attractive the siutation is just f*cked up for us.
With the type of relationship that I think will be produced I don’t see any point in it being maintained. The guy could possibly be getting what he desires as she depends on him financially so his happiness is really her survival but she’s getting what- a guy who earns more. He only earns more because her freedoms were limited solely so he could have a chance at getting her. So while he may be motivated and not be feeling exploited what about his partner? The gals being kept out of college will likely feel repressed and resentful as it will likely be going back to the days were any guy as long as he’s not that abusive was a good catch because she relied on him for a paycheck. Her motivation to keep the relationship will be to have a roof over her head she since he is her livelihood since with America’s economy a college degree is like a necessity.
So rather than a proposed husband shortage where gals aren’t with the guys they want & guys look for women from other countries there’s repressing a group’s freedoms, education, and self sufficiency one gender to give men a superior hand.
Biology always wins is exactly why I think my proposal of ‘keep the lads in college’ is a healthier option than let’s cut the opportunities and self-sufficiency of the opposite gender so that we’ll make more money than them so we’ll be superior and thus they’ll go for use for finances. It forgets the missing biological factor that women are less visual not blind so generally they want physical attraction as well. So while ‘keep the dames out of college’ may lead to more men having relationships from women relying on them financially and essentially using the ones they aren’t attracted to as suckers it may also lead to more female cheating. Also biologically people don’t like being repressed or limited and I’m guessing women will know that these men aren’t really quality but that the standards are vastly lower. Just like I know if I moved to a new city where the girls were way uglier that the most attractive girl there isn’t really all that.
Rather than put a group down and lower the standards for my group I’ll go with improving myself.
28 year old woman: I will not marry a man who has an income smaller than my own.
Same 28 year old woman: I WILL marry a man who earns more than me.
In other words, women don’t want to marry down, but they want to marry-up.
@NMH: “in a lot of these couplings the woman may marry, but may hold back on having kids. The reason is because even though he may have some money, he is low status.”
This chick here would really rather prefer to adopt no matter the man b/c o/overpopulation for people in poverty & consumerism (& destruction of natural resources) for the rich is often the case.
Meanwhile, marrying a mechanic/welder/plumber seems like a great idea. He can support me while I take care of the kids before they enter formal schooling, and I can support him in an intellectual job when it is too physically difficult for him to work anymore.
Woman cooks dinner, man fixes sink. He’s genetically predisposed to be physically stronger and have slightly better geometric skills anyhow.
Intellectuals continue to bang their secretaries as always.
@the same: “She would better off with somebody alike, and if something needs to be fixed in the house, pay the plumber and end of the story.”
Men who work in manual labor have something intellectual men don’t: common sense. You think that’s not hot in a conversation?
And at least they don’t pretend they listen. They’ll be honest about *just* staring at your boobs.
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I don’t see why you are trying to solve a western women’s issue for them that they created by chioce.
Us men simply don’t need them.
There are millions of far superior women in the world that highly value western men.
I would never date a western woman again.