I have recently changed my standard outgoing message to include this line:
So I have a question for you… what are the top five things that would make you an excellent romantic partner? I know my top five and will be happy to share when I get your response.
It’s the second paragraph in every online dating website message I send.
In the past three days I have sent out 18 messages on Plenty of Fish. Here is the response rate:
5 read deleted
3 unread deleted
9 no responses (if no response after a week, I will consider it a rejection)
1 vaguely positive response
This is a similar response rate to my previous efforts.
As well, I have had some unsolicited incoming traffic:
1 message
1 favoriting
4 meet requests
I was not attracted to any of those women for a variety of reasons; mostly because they are either seriously overweight or live too far away.
The one response was interesting (she took three days to reply):
hi Private Man and thanks for writing.. you seem funny & intelligent thats good for starters. i dont know what 5 things would make me an excellent romantic partner.. i have been kind of moving thru life lately, more like a mother, friend, daughter, sister and not so much a partner. and likely, walls have built up.. i am not sure how much i even like a guy asking me that question as his first connection.. sounds like something from eharmony
This is quite the honest response and perhaps indicates that my standard question is offputting. I have a mental image of a woman reading my message to her and thinking to herself “How dare anyone question my desirability as a romantic partner!”
I’m going to do an experiment with the next batch of outgoing messages. I’m going to remove the question and see if my response rate increases.
I haven’t yet responded to the woman who sent the message. I have to wait at least three days for that (online Game). I’m not sure of the nature of my response at this point. This might be an opportunity to engage this woman to yield some more information about her reaction to my message. Of course, that assumes she’s thoughtful and introspective. Oh, nevermind.
Hughman
/ May 5, 2011As I said before PM, it’s OTT in a first message. Forcing the frame control is too obvious. I await your results though : )
NMH
/ May 5, 2011Yea, I think that comes on a little to strong. I suspect what you are trying to do is make it seem like she needs to qualify herself, but I think it might come off as you are thinking about relationships alot–which comes off as needy and desperate. Also, five is too much, most women dont know themselves to think of that many. Reduce it to two if you still use this line.
I like your scientific approach, though, in that you quantify the responses you get for your line. As a STEM geek, I heartily approve of this approach.
*drinks a gallon of soy milk, burps*
theprivateman
/ May 5, 2011I’ll post the results of the new batch of messages should I get some responses.
Bohemian Rockstar
/ May 5, 2011Hey private man,
I’ve been reading for a while, and this morning in Australia it’s a glorious morning and I’m having a bohemian breakfast in the sun, so I thought I’d like to do something unusual, being to comment.
Firstly, I like online dating, and after 2 years of trial and error, I had my response rate to about 60% and I was meeting two new girls a week.
I don’t really need to validate myself, but if someone told me what I know now, I’d be a year an a half ahead.
But then again, it’s a sunny morning and I could just be trolling.
Firstly, I found pof to be a waste of time. Full of time wasters
theprivateman
/ May 5, 2011What age demographic are you in?
If you have some good tips and advice, please share!
I have found that certain online dating websites are more popular in certain areas. While agree that there are many time-wasters on PoF, it has the most members here in South Florida.
Bohemian Rockstar
/ May 5, 2011Hey private man,
I’ve been reading for a while, and this morning in Australia it’s a glorious morning and I’m having a bohemian breakfast in the sun, so I thought I’d like to do something unusual, being to comment.
I like online dating. After two years of working it out, I had a 60% response rate and I was meeting up with at least two new women a week. I meet my current girlfriend online.
So, now that I’ve dhv’d myself, my point being, that if someone told because I know now, I’d saved a year and a half.
But I could be just trolling as I drink my coffee.
Firstly, pof is a waste of time. It’s full of time wasters and attention seekers. Because it’s free. That would be why your response rate is so low. What type of relationship do you want? Don’t be cheap, buy a subscription. I used e harmony because you are ore approved and the women want to meet some one.
Put it under your entertainment budget.
Now, it sounds like your email is to long. Be different than the other 3000 other guys emailing her. In the title put “….something about your profile”. And in the body put “I noticed that in your profile you put you like to wrestle sharks?….you sound like an interesting and fun girl….”
This shows you read their profile and then they will validate your comments. You need to read a program called “secrets of online dating”. It will save you years.
Be different.
I have a PDF copy that I can send you that will go through the process I use (if I can locate it on my harddrive).
Good luck
Firstly, I like online dating, and after 2 years of trial and error, I had my response rate to about 60% and I was meeting two new girls a week.
I don’t really need to validate myself, but if someone told me what I know now, I’d be a year an a half ahead.
But then again, it’s a sunny morning and I could just be trolling.
Firstly, I found pof to be a waste of time. Full of time wasters
theprivateman
/ May 5, 2011This is exactly what I do.
Subject line: shows that I have read the profile.
First paragraph: A brief comment on that profile (so many women write so little, it’s frustrating)
Second paragraph: call to action. “I’d like to start a bit of a correspondence with the intent of actually meeting at some point soon. After all, the purpose of online dating is to go out on actual dates!”
No more postscript. No more paragraph about the top five things.
I’m fairly average looking but it decent shape (under 200 lbs and 5’11″ tall). Perhaps it’s my big, bald head that turns ‘em off.
I’ll look into that book but if you’d like to share, you can find my contact info on the Contact Me page.
Bohemian Rockstar
/ May 5, 2011Sorry, damn I phone…. And chatting to the waitress…. Forgive the random posting, not on my computer.
I’m 40 and divorced with two kids and a pet fish…
Bohemian Rockstar
/ May 6, 2011Hey Comrade,
Just got back from skate boarding.
I sent you the “inside Internet Dating” book and copies of my emails I sent.
Good luck, it worked for me…..
The Private Man
/ May 6, 2011Got it, thanks!
I’ve read through the PDF a bit and checked out the emails. My process is quite similar, as it turns out.
I can’t really say why my response rate is low. But I’ve talked to other guys in this area and they report much the same thing in regards to online dating. Perhaps it’s a local entitlement attitude here or perhaps my profile simply sucks…
I will review and re-tool my profile and see what happens.
andy
/ May 6, 2011Hi PM,
No girl can list what actually turns her on – they simply don’t think about it. Your question seems intentionally obtuse.
With all the attention they get online, you need to separate yourself from the herd. The last thing in the world she is going to do is take the time to list anything. Seriously, the men out number women by 10 to 1 on those sites.
Your profile should make it seem that you are living the dream and if they want to come along for the ride, great. If not, great – someone else will.
theprivateman
/ May 6, 2011I’ve just sent out a new batch of messages without the question.
As for the proportion of men to women on the online dating websites, the balance is not as bad as you might think. In fact, I’ve been told that gender ratio above age 45 is actually almost equal. It appears so unbalanced for two reasons:
1. The most attractive women get the most messages
2. Men are expected to send the first message
My profile is framed just as you advise. Here is a paragraph:
I think it does the job.
NMH
/ May 6, 2011That quote above you are using is perfect. Have to agree with Andy, women really wont be able to articulate what turns them on. The know they feel the tingle when it happens but they either not sure why or they are too embarrassed to admit is is something primal and non-PC feminist, like bulging biceps.
*makes soy shake, drinks it while drooling on stained couch*
andy
/ May 6, 2011Awesome. Just so you don’t think I am only critisizing, here is the message I sent my now baby mama! She has mentioned many times that this set me apart from the herd.
Hi,
I don’t put a lot of information in my profile because I feel a bit uneasy about divulging personal information to anyone who wants to read it.
I do however want you to know more about me, since I find you attractive.
Most of my time is spent working (I am a __________). My work is very technical and challenging, and it brings about a certain calmness and civility to my life.
Leisure time right now is something of a luxury. Leisure activities include motorcycling, jet skiing, and lounging in the sun around the pool. Live music is a must for any weekend night. I kinda like the energy of the club scene; but I don’t go very often.
My emotions are well grounded, and I am not a needy person; fiercely independent.
I think life is short and messy, and I try to live my life accordingly; well mannered but not reserved.
As mentioned in my profile, I am divorced. My ex and I parted on amicable terms. The divorce was actually a relief to both of us – it was done in 30 days without the need for ugly court battles. Hence, the process has left me decidedly un-bitter!
I have two boys, ages _ and _ that live in ______. They live with me for most of the summer since I cannot visit them often.
A few of my life philosophies include: each day is borrowed – make it count; this is the greatest country on the earth – nowhere else does opportunity abound like the U.S.; without taking chances, there is no sizeable gain; hope is a faint siren song; once you taste some real success you’ll forget about hope and wallow in the delights of reality.
Musical interests include metal, blues, and hard rock. Favorite bands at the moment are Mudvayne, Static X, B.B. King, Pantera, Sepultura, and Volbeat. Music is very important to me; it affects me like no other medium can. You can take my TV, video games, etc as long as I have music. Music is the last refuge for non-politically correct artists; the last place they can express what is really on their mind. Therefore, lyrics are often raw and real, not fairy tales.
My femme fatale is a girly girl.
Workshy Joe
/ May 6, 2011Private man, you are very persistent with POF, I’ll give you that.
Have you had a look at the POF forums?
http://forums.plentyoffish.com/
Its definitely worth a look if you are using the active part of POF. It can get a little rough and rowdy in there sometimes, but still – check it out.
I will underscore the point that if you want any results from sites like POF that your strategy will have to be contrarian beyond belief and you will also have to be ruthless at screening out the attention whores.
How’s your day Game coming along btw?
theprivateman
/ May 6, 2011I was a regular PoF forum participant a few years back. It was fun to smack down all the entitlement princesses but ultimately it grew wearisome.
I do ruthlessly screen for attention whores and despite my efforts, have still run into one or two. The biggest problem are the online flakes.
My day game is going quite well. Fridays are the best when there is live music in the village and everyone is in a good mood. I have been practicing on the tourists and it’s a lot of fun. Two Fridays ago I was running sets on a mother and two adult daughters (tourists from Minnesota). I was running complete asshole game on the youngest daughter (married and 31 years old) and within 30 minutes mom was taking photos of the daughters being all affectionate with me. “Meeting you was the best part of our trip.” This from the youngest daughter.
I used one of the photos in my online dating profile!
Workshy Joe
/ May 6, 2011The tourist thing is a great idea. When women are on holiday they are so much more open and receptive to meeting guys.
Have you tried any of the paid dating sites?
whiteboykrispy
/ June 1, 2011I just started a PoF & OkC account, if you have any suggestions I’d appreciate it.
http://whiteboykrispy.wordpress.com/2011/06/01/i-started-an-online-dating-accounts/
Mark
/ October 29, 2011Always good advice on here. My response rate is one in six and I end up meeting about half the responders. Mentioning similarity of interests works best for me. And, as private man says in his method, don’t talk about their looks. Do not send “u r sooo Hot!” emails. It doesn’t work, at least not for me. Always having two or three women you’re working on is probably a good idea too but I don’t follow it completely. I’m partly too lazy to juggle multiple women, have too many other interests, and have moral qualms when I think about the possibility of picking up an std from one female and passing it on to another female. As long as a relationship hasn’t come to sex yet, though, I’ll still be emailing other women because so many of these online relationships don’t lead anywhere. Too many women over-valuing themselves and not realizing the guy they want is never going to be interested in them because that guy can do better. I had a spinster aunt like that who kept rejecting guys as not good enough until one day she got so old the guys didn’t come around anymore.
It’s
/ March 23, 2012Truly worthwhile write-up. Spend attention